When Nice Is Too Nice

by on July 27, 2010

in Allison Nazarian, Real Life, Unsolicited Advice from Allison

One of the questions I’ve been thinking about lately is this one: Is there such a thing as being too nice?

For those of you with little patience and/or who want to know the answer right away here it is:

Yes.

Yes, there is such a thing as being too nice.

I know because I have been too nice. Hell, I am still too nice.

And “too nice” is not a compliment or something I am boasting about, by the way.

I actually started thinking about this question a few weeks ago when George Steinbrenner died. Steinbrenner was the longtime, never-a-dull moment, love-him-or-hate-him owner of the New York Yankees baseball team.

I’m not a terribly big baseball fan. I don’t care one way or the other about the Yankees. And I have no emotional connection to Steinbrenner or the organization.

I did take the opportunity to stir up some trouble and text a friend, a diehard Mets’ fan (for those of you who don’t know, the Mets and the Yankees are arch rivals), with a “RIP Steinbrenner” message.

His reply to me:

“F*** Steinbrenner.”

Wow, I thought. Harsh! (As my Dad always jokingly asks: “Should we put him in the ‘Undecided’ Column?”)

Sure, he is entitled to his opinion. And I totally understand sports rivalries. I have passion for my football team, and I don’t wish rivals well.

But I couldn’t see myself saying that about someone simply because they weren’t the nicest or I didn’t like how they conducted business.

And that’s the thing: The guy was a true giant of sports and of business. He was known for turning his team into on of the top franchises in all of professional sports. He was also known for doing it without caring much about what “everyone else” thought of him.

If we are constantly worrying about everyone liking us and scared of shaking the cages, how on earth will we ever have the time or brain power to actually do great things?

And speaking of great things, isn’t that what some people really hate? That he did so well? Great things are not always embraced or welcomed by all. Great things do not make best friends and raving fans of everyone. So of course his rivals and their fans “hated” him – he was the best at what he did, which was basically ensuring that it would be that-much-harder for any other team to be the best.

Let’s face it: If Steinbrenner had been a failure, a guy with not much to say, a guy who knew nothing about business, a guy unable to create the most successful baseball franchise of all time, then would anyone hate him?

Of course not.

They’d probably feel sorry for him and figure out the best way to get rid of him.  Whiners, under-achievers, lame-os – they don’t generally make it in business in any long-term sense. (Or in baseball for that matter.)

In the early days of my business, I allowed much – too much — in the name of being nice, in the name of not having someone think I was a b*tch. (By the way, we women seem to have this problem more than men. We fear the b*tch term, whereas a man would be called smart or shrewd, we are called b*tches and can be criticized for doing business in ways that would be lauded in men. But I digress.)

And even before I had a business, I cared a lot about being nice. Or having people think I am nice. To this day, I over-do things to ensure that I am perceived as nice. And as I write this, I’m seeing just how much I busy myself, at times, with being nice instead of with being productive or focused.

Don’t get me wrong: Being kind, being respectful, treating others as you wish to be treated and respecting karma are all crucial parts of being a good and successful person in the world.

I simply will not be friends with, do business with or, as much as I can possibly help it, have any association with people who are not nice. Maybe that sounds silly or immature, but I don’t care. That’s a non-negotiable.

Again: Being. Nice. Is. Crucial.

Now that said, being nice can also be a distraction.

Being nice can be an excuse.

Being nice can be a way of avoidance. Avoidance of action that could lead to success that could lead to recognition and that could lead, perhaps, to criticism, or disagreement, or confrontation or, gasp!, people not thinking you are nice.

Yep, being nice can be a crock of sh*t sometimes.

Can you be wildly successful (whatever success means to you, be it rich, famous, #1 or whatever) AND nice?

Yes, you can.

Can you be wildly successful if being nice is your #1 priority?

I don’t think so. (Feel free to prove me wrong…I’m all ears.)

I’ve been in all sorts of situations in which I have not been treated nicely. From the garden-variety ignorant rude people who actually may not have known better (not an excuse) to the business partner who cheated me —to lots of not-so-nice people in-between, I’ve seen and experienced them all.

And, always, my first reaction was something like:

“But how could he/she do that/say that/be that way? I ‘ve been so NICE!”

God, it sounds so naive.

I’ve been in business long enough to know that nice doesn’t cut it when we are talking objective stuff like the bottom line. Of course, nice is about more than business. Nice is (or is not) everywhere, in all aspects of our lives.

Case in point: About two months ago, I had a party one Sunday at my house with a small group of close friends. Immediately following the party, someone who’d just been at my house for 7 or 8 hours said something that was totally unexpected and inappropriate. It was also very nasty and hurtful. I was shocked and confused by what I felt was an attack.

I asked this person why they would make fun of me in that way, especially after telling me in confidence at the party how sensitive they are about things and how much they wished people would like them more. I told them they’d hurt me and that I was surprised to be at the receiving end of the cruel comments.

After communicating my feelings and reaction, I decided to let the issue (and this person) go. Turns out I didn’t have to make this decision because they never apologized, never acknowledged what had been done and never even replied to me again.

I tried to understand that this person had/has some serious issues with having people who really care about them, so their way of “protecting” themselves is to alienate people and move on (I’d seen this person do it previously.)

I bring up this incident here because it is an example of someone for whom being NICE is not a factor or consideration. This person didn’t care about being nice. This person was not nice…they knew it and didn’t try to change it or make it better.

Maybe they know know something I don’t know about getting ahead in life via that route. But that kind of “not nice” scares me. Alienates me. Totally and utterly confuses me. It is just not part of who I am or who I could be.

While I in no way shape or form aspire to it., I am certainly in awe of it. Not the behavior itself, which is abhorrent. But the ability to act and do and be in a way that does not care or take into account the opinions or feelings of anyone or anything else. (I wouldn’t mind if a tad of the not caring part of it were in my fabric. Like a superhero, I’d of course use it for good )

So…what is the opposite of “too nice?”

It isn’t mean or nasty or rude.

It certainly isn’t cruel or hurtful.

Perhaps it is indifference.

Or self-centeredness (if you are so focused on yourself, no way you can care about others).

Or total disconnectedness from one’s own feelings and the feelings of others.

And what happens when one isn’t nice? Perhaps people think and act differently toward you. But maybe that was the goal in the first place. The world doesn’t end, no. But that doesn’t mean it’s a good thing.

There is a middle ground, of course.

It’s a place with boundaries, and respect and manners.

It’s a place where kindness exists, but sugar and spice don’t have to.

It’s a place I’ve visited and probably would do well to visit more.

It’s a place where nice doesn’t happen in a vacuum and nice doesn’t waste anyone’s time. And, yes, it is a place where not everyone who wants to can hang and not everyone you know even wants to hang.

You probably know where it is and how to get there. Me too.

Meetcha there ;)

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    [...] This post was mentioned on Twitter by Erin Blaskie, Elizabeth Weinstein, Allison Nazarian, Amy Courser, Jennifer McPadden and others. Jennifer McPadden said: NICE read. RT @AllisonNazarian: [New Post] When Nice Is Too Nice: http://tinyurl.com/allinice [...]

  • http://elizabethpottsweinstein.com ElizabethPW

    Yes. It's the middle ground were we are nice and caring but still set boundaries and are kickass when needed. We can be feminine and powerful at the same time.

    #loveyou

  • http://elizabethpottsweinstein.com ElizabethPW

    Yes. It's the middle ground were we are nice and caring but still set boundaries and are kickass when needed. We can be feminine and powerful at the same time.

    #loveyou

  • meganmatthieson

    Niiicceee. The road to nice starts with how nice you are to yourself. Set up the unbreakable tie to yourself and know that you are completely committed to caring for yourself. (I sound good, don't I?) Once this is in place (god- I'm so full of myself today) you can spread the love. Or the nice. But. You know. Me first. :)

  • meganmatthieson

    Niiicceee. The road to nice starts with how nice you are to yourself. Set up the unbreakable tie to yourself and know that you are completely committed to caring for yourself. (I sound good, don't I?) Once this is in place (god- I'm so full of myself today) you can spread the love. Or the nice. But. You know. Me first. :)

  • Jennifer

    “Mediocrity always attacks excellence”

  • shawnacevraini

    I too have struggled with these questions! Wow! It is very hard for us “too nice” people to find that middle ground. I want to be that person that tells it like it is even when that might mean hurting someone's feelings. I'm not very good at that. I want everyone to just get along. But, I know that's impossible. That we all have different opinions and feelings. Thanks for this post Alison. I want to find that middle ground too! I'll meetcha there!

  • shawnacevraini

    I too have struggled with these questions! Wow! It is very hard for us “too nice” people to find that middle ground. I want to be that person that tells it like it is even when that might mean hurting someone's feelings. I'm not very good at that. I want everyone to just get along. But, I know that's impossible. That we all have different opinions and feelings. Thanks for this post Alison. I want to find that middle ground too! I'll meetcha there!

  • http://www.randomshelly.com/blog/ Shelly

    Definitely love the middle ground – There are times where you have to venture out and be a b*tch though!

    Good for you for saying good-bye to that person! (wondering what will happen in a few months when they try to make contact like nothing happened? maybe they won't – just been my experience when people are asses – they need/want something and act all “What?”

    and I'm going to digress – sorry – but am having a moment… LOL in HS, I'll never forget – some girl came up to me because her boyfriend had called me.. She said, “Leave my boyfriend alone” I said,”I didn't call him… if he is not happy in your relationship and calls me, that is not my fault” she choked a sec and then said “You are such a b*tch” and since this word never did and still doesn't bother me… I said “Yeah, and your point is?” she was speechless. Makes me laugh to this day. (Is that bad?) <<don't care just asking :)

    I think that digression came because I agree that women get called that incorrectly… If you stand up for yourself, if you voice your opinion and debate it to prove you're right, or if you stick to your guns about something you believe… in most business situations and personal too – you are called a b*tch.. but to me that is not the definition.. that is you being you and being CONFIDENT… a B*tch to me is someone who intentionally, purposefully goes out of their way to hurt someone, to lie, to cheat, to steal, etc… think catty, think passive aggressive… :)

    ok, done :)

  • http://www.randomshelly.com/blog/ Shelly

    Definitely love the middle ground – There are times where you have to venture out and be a b*tch though!

    Good for you for saying good-bye to that person! (wondering what will happen in a few months when they try to make contact like nothing happened? maybe they won't – just been my experience when people are asses – they need/want something and act all “What?”

    and I'm going to digress – sorry – but am having a moment… LOL in HS, I'll never forget – some girl came up to me because her boyfriend had called me.. She said, “Leave my boyfriend alone” I said,”I didn't call him… if he is not happy in your relationship and calls me, that is not my fault” she choked a sec and then said “You are such a b*tch” and since this word never did and still doesn't bother me… I said “Yeah, and your point is?” she was speechless. Makes me laugh to this day. (Is that bad?) <<don't care just asking :)

    I think that digression came because I agree that women get called that incorrectly… If you stand up for yourself, if you voice your opinion and debate it to prove you're right, or if you stick to your guns about something you believe… in most business situations and personal too – you are called a b*tch.. but to me that is not the definition.. that is you being you and being CONFIDENT… a B*tch to me is someone who intentionally, purposefully goes out of their way to hurt someone, to lie, to cheat, to steal, etc… think catty, think passive aggressive… :)

    ok, done :)

  • http://www.krisenkindt.com Krisenkindt

    “Nice” post Alli :) I really enjoyed reading it.

    As I answered to your twitter question, for me “too nice” really depends on the side you are looking at. Being genuinely kind and helping people where needed and wanted can make one way nicer than anyone else, yet not “too nice”.
    Being “too nice” for me has less to do with being nice in the sense that I, coming from German, know the word but rather it has to do with not putting yourself first when you definitely should. Its nearly like being too shy or too afraid to speak up and say no when really it would be necessary. Maybe I'd even liken it to a lack of self respect. Thats probably harsh, but definitely the closest I could get in English to explain where “too nice” would stand in my native language in comparison to “being nice”.

    I don't mean being self centered as solution, but there are situations where you have to come first, where you have to say “I don't have to put up with this, screw you, have a nice life but good bye.”

    Sometimes you just have to be smart (like you describe men, and I would say the same for woman). Putting yourself first. And as a lady you should never be scared to do so, afraid to get called a bitch.

    Here is a personal example: 90% of the people I work with are men. Moreover, they are farmers and agronomists (thats a special type of guy, I can tell you), they are mostly twice as old, and to top it all off they are brazilian old school machos. I love working with them, its fun and they are super smart and I can learn a lot from them. But first of all: I learned that if I don't sometimes interrupt, say No! and kick their butts if I have to, then nothing I need to get done with their help will ever be done cause I'd be too nice to earn respect. At first it scared me, but really, when I am “too nice” as you describe it, I just am annoyed with me afterwards. I'd say that I am a very caring and “nice” person, as are my friends and family, as I learned it all my life. But also just like they do, I claim respect and the right to be egoistic in my decisions and responses at times.
    “Bitch” is way further. Bitch is when you leave collateral damage on your way up the latter, its where men would be calles a**holes. Thats not necessary and absolutely inappropriate. People like that should not be the people one shares time with.

    In my opinion, there is no need to trick and really hurt people to get far in life, but there is the ned to put yourself first at times. And if you know when that is, and when you should let go, than you have found your middle grounds.

    mmmh, I wrote another novel. Think I am done now. hahaha

  • http://www.krisenkindt.com Krisenkindt

    “Nice” post Alli :) I really enjoyed reading it.

    As I answered to your twitter question, for me “too nice” really depends on the side you are looking at. Being genuinely kind and helping people where needed and wanted can make one way nicer than anyone else, yet not “too nice”.
    Being “too nice” for me has less to do with being nice in the sense that I, coming from German, know the word but rather it has to do with not putting yourself first when you definitely should. Its nearly like being too shy or too afraid to speak up and say no when really it would be necessary. Maybe I'd even liken it to a lack of self respect. Thats probably harsh, but definitely the closest I could get in English to explain where “too nice” would stand in my native language in comparison to “being nice”.

    I don't mean being self centered as solution, but there are situations where you have to come first, where you have to say “I don't have to put up with this, screw you, have a nice life but good bye.”

    Sometimes you just have to be smart (like you describe men, and I would say the same for woman). Putting yourself first. And as a lady you should never be scared to do so, afraid to get called a bitch.

    Here is a personal example: 90% of the people I work with are men. Moreover, they are farmers and agronomists (thats a special type of guy, I can tell you), they are mostly twice as old, and to top it all off they are brazilian old school machos. I love working with them, its fun and they are super smart and I can learn a lot from them. But first of all: I learned that if I don't sometimes interrupt, say No! and kick their butts if I have to, then nothing I need to get done with their help will ever be done cause I'd be too nice to earn respect. At first it scared me, but really, when I am “too nice” as you describe it, I just am annoyed with me afterwards. I'd say that I am a very caring and “nice” person, as are my friends and family, as I learned it all my life. But also just like they do, I claim respect and the right to be egoistic in my decisions and responses at times.
    “Bitch” is way further. Bitch is when you leave collateral damage on your way up the latter, its where men would be calles a**holes. Thats not necessary and absolutely inappropriate. People like that should not be the people one shares time with.

    In my opinion, there is no need to trick and really hurt people to get far in life, but there is the ned to put yourself first at times. And if you know when that is, and when you should let go, than you have found your middle grounds.

    mmmh, I wrote another novel. Think I am done now. hahaha

  • http://membershipjedi.com MikeCassidy

    Do nice guys/girls always finish last? Not necessarily, they may finish in the middle after having had their kindness taken advantage of by those finish ahead. As a long suffering Red Sox fan, I am quite familiar with the late Mr. Steinbrenner and the empire he built. I once ran into him in a hotel, and he was…nice. Not too nice, but pleasant. Only we can define success for ourselves, no one else. If we spend our lives worried about what others think about us, we'll realize later on that they weren't thinking about us at all (high school flashbacks).

    Nice post. See you somewhere between the Yankees and Niceville.

  • http://membershipjedi.com MikeCassidy

    Do nice guys/girls always finish last? Not necessarily, they may finish in the middle after having had their kindness taken advantage of by those finish ahead. As a long suffering Red Sox fan, I am quite familiar with the late Mr. Steinbrenner and the empire he built. I once ran into him in a hotel, and he was…nice. Not too nice, but pleasant. Only we can define success for ourselves, no one else. If we spend our lives worried about what others think about us, we'll realize later on that they weren't thinking about us at all (high school flashbacks).

    Nice post. See you somewhere between the Yankees and Niceville.

  • http://awakenyoursoul.wordpress.com/ Peggie

    For me it's all about owning my own voice and trusting it to be enough. Because my TRUE voice is always respectful of others and my own boundaries. It speaks my truth, even if it may be hard to hear, but it's never out to hurt another. If someone is hurt through a true misunderstanding, It's an opportunity for dialogue and further learning — for us both (sad you're former friend is too frozen right now for this growth opportunity). I'm quite often putting my foot in my mouth – not because I desire to be mean (or not nice) but because my mouth works far too fast for the rest of me…I try to ensure that I'm being impeccable with my words — so even if they are words I'm eating, they are somewhat exotic and tasty.

    Excellent, thought provoking post.

    And RIP George. (I'm a Yankee fan – and That's nice :) )

  • http://awakenyoursoul.wordpress.com/ Peggie

    For me it's all about owning my own voice and trusting it to be enough. Because my TRUE voice is always respectful of others and my own boundaries. It speaks my truth, even if it may be hard to hear, but it's never out to hurt another. If someone is hurt through a true misunderstanding, It's an opportunity for dialogue and further learning — for us both (sad you're former friend is too frozen right now for this growth opportunity). I'm quite often putting my foot in my mouth – not because I desire to be mean (or not nice) but because my mouth works far too fast for the rest of me…I try to ensure that I'm being impeccable with my words — so even if they are words I'm eating, they are somewhat exotic and tasty.

    Excellent, thought provoking post.

    And RIP George. (I'm a Yankee fan – and That's nice :) )

  • http://allisonnazarian.com/ Allison Nazarian

    I love your comments!
    Love what you said to that girl in HS. I am working on getting that side of me back. Being nice is NOT ALL THAT.
    xoxo ~ Alli

  • http://allisonnazarian.com/ Allison Nazarian

    I love your comments!
    Love what you said to that girl in HS. I am working on getting that side of me back. Being nice is NOT ALL THAT.
    xoxo ~ Alli

  • http://allisonnazarian.com/ Allison Nazarian

    So true. I think esp for women, this can be tough. Caretakers, blah blah blah. But that is getting/is old, ya know?
    If I am not nice to myself, the nice I am to other people may not even really be truly nice (does that make sense?) . More like me feeling I am *supposed* to be nice.

  • http://allisonnazarian.com/ Allison Nazarian

    So true. I think esp for women, this can be tough. Caretakers, blah blah blah. But that is getting/is old, ya know?
    If I am not nice to myself, the nice I am to other people may not even really be truly nice (does that make sense?) . More like me feeling I am *supposed* to be nice.

  • http://allisonnazarian.com/ Allison Nazarian

    As I told you in the email, nothing I could say in this comment would top your line:

    “I try to ensure that I'm being impeccable with my words — so even if they are words I'm eating, they are somewhat exotic and tasty.”

    #thatisall

    xo ~ Alli

  • http://allisonnazarian.com/ Allison Nazarian

    As I told you in the email, nothing I could say in this comment would top your line:

    “I try to ensure that I'm being impeccable with my words — so even if they are words I'm eating, they are somewhat exotic and tasty.”

    #thatisall

    xo ~ Alli

  • http://allisonnazarian.com/ Allison Nazarian

    Hi Mike!
    Thank you for the comment.
    Agree — totally about the time/energy we put into worrying what “they” think of us. And truth is, 1) they may not even be thinking of us anyway and/or 2) who really cares anyway? Does it matter? What is the worst they could think?

    ~ Alli

  • http://allisonnazarian.com/ Allison Nazarian

    Hi Mike!
    Thank you for the comment.
    Agree — totally about the time/energy we put into worrying what “they” think of us. And truth is, 1) they may not even be thinking of us anyway and/or 2) who really cares anyway? Does it matter? What is the worst they could think?

    ~ Alli

  • http://allisonnazarian.com/ Allison Nazarian

    Hi! I so love your “novels” and your insight.
    I totally get your comparison. I watch a lot of football and usually end up w mostly males. I always observe how they talk to each other, what they say, how they say it. And they spend so little time thinking and caring how it comes off and just saying what they want to say. It seems so easy and simple. And really it is. It is the over-thinking and over-doing (even over-doing nice) that complicates.

    Thank you AS ALWAYS!
    ~ Alli

  • http://allisonnazarian.com/ Allison Nazarian

    Hi! I so love your “novels” and your insight.
    I totally get your comparison. I watch a lot of football and usually end up w mostly males. I always observe how they talk to each other, what they say, how they say it. And they spend so little time thinking and caring how it comes off and just saying what they want to say. It seems so easy and simple. And really it is. It is the over-thinking and over-doing (even over-doing nice) that complicates.

    Thank you AS ALWAYS!
    ~ Alli

  • http://allisonnazarian.com/ Allison Nazarian

    Yay meetcha there!
    :)
    xo ~ Alli

  • http://allisonnazarian.com/ Allison Nazarian

    Yay meetcha there!
    :)
    xo ~ Alli

  • http://allisonnazarian.com/ Allison Nazarian

    So true….

  • http://allisonnazarian.com/ Allison Nazarian

    So true….

  • http://allisonnazarian.com/ Allison Nazarian

    Yes.
    #loveyoutoo

  • http://allisonnazarian.com/ Allison Nazarian

    Yes.
    #loveyoutoo

  • meganmatthieson

    Yes. Bullshit nice. :)

  • meganmatthieson

    Yes. Bullshit nice. :)

  • Laura Scholz

    Love the design and love the post. Reminds me of one about “not always being liked.” And a variation on that–once had a boss I would’ve LOVED to get approval from. But she was mean, moody, bitter and enjoyed terrorizing her staff. I eventually decided that I didn’t WANT to be liked by someone like her. That’s one extreme.

    And the other is ones like you and me. Sensitive souls who will bend over backwards for people, whether or not they would reciprocate or are even worth the time. I think that’s the distinction. I try to be kind and generous and thoughtful. But I can’t be all things to all people. And sometimes, you have to stand up for yourself. Sometimes that’s considered bitchy or assertive or “not nice.” Sometimes, you have to put yourself first. Lesson learned from my first marriage–because if you don’t, someone else will.

    And at the end of the day, if you’re always “nice,” if everyones like you, then in my opinion, you haven’t done anything remarkable or memorable or distinguishable. Sometimes, being true to yourself, and in my opinion, truly raw and honest living, means pissing some people off. But those are probably people I wouldn’t like anyway.

    And I find the busiest I get, the sharper my sense of self is, the more I can let people like the one you’re talking about just go…

    xoxo

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  • murrayiz

    In business, it's not about being nice or not nice (yes, you should always treat people with respect, and it's not necessarily a zero sum game) to succeed. I've seen very nice people succeed, and also the world's largest pri*ks succeed.

    For all of them, the key to success (aside from actually delivering high value) was having zero worries about what everyone else thought about what they were doing. Because, at the beginning, middle, and end of the day, it really doesn't matter what anyone else thinks.

    Both types were successful, it's just that some were just much more pleasant to be around than the others.

    And then there's a difference between being nice, and saying 'No.' It's a great word, that isn't used as much as it should be, for most people. Used judiciously, it can be very empowering and powerful.

  • http://allisonnazarian.com/ Allison Nazarian

    Eff that bullshit nice sh-t. (Why did I write it out on bullshit but not the second one? Weird. I left it there so you could see.)
    xo ~Alli

  • http://allisonnazarian.com/ Allison Nazarian

    Totally agree re “no.” As the great Anne Lamott says, “No is a complete sentence.”

  • http://allisonnazarian.com/ Allison Nazarian

    “if you're always “nice,” if everyones like you, then in my opinion, you haven't done anything remarkable or memorable or distinguishable.” <—- YES